“There will never be a generation of great men until there has been a generation of free women -- of free mothers.”

We have had free women and free mothers for some time now, and I haven't yet noticed a generation of great men. There have always, in every generation, been great individual men because they have had the freedom to choose greatness. When women became (become in some parts of the world) entirely free, they will have the same choice. Some will be great individuals, some will not.

The implication is that until women are free, men cannot be considered great.

It is the group identity that bothers me about this quote. Condemning or commending entire generations of men or women based upon the actions of an elite group of oligarchical politicians is wrong. Judge people by their individual actions.

It was not the politicians that imposed archaic standards on women, but a large portion of the male population.

David, as you say it was a large portion of the male population, not the entire group. I think one of the things that contributed to women's equality was the settling of the American west. The competence and hard work of the pioneer women showed the men how valuable they were in very difficult circumstances. When these women were given the opportunity to shine, they did, and their men saw it.

I hate to disagree with Ingersoll, as I do respect his agnostic views, but I don't accept there can't be great men without free women, as witness him and his own generation and that of our founding fathers. I think there were greater men then than today, with women more free than theirs were

Sin is not freedom. The greater the deprecation of women, the less true greatness is known or gets taught to future generations. One of the aspects that generated so much hatred for the early Christian Church was that women were not just property but equal to men. Ahhh, another Divine principle perverted.