Waffler, the problem I have with gettting off this conspiracy thing is that something inside me won't let me get on the slavery thing. I agree nwo's have existed and continue to exist but there is only one order set up by the laws of nature that works and is the best for everyone. It was first used in America and is lost now but, because nature has final say in its creation it will return and your glorified new version of a world order coming upon us now can't change that fact because it can't change those laws. Pervert them for a time yes, but never change them. Why do you think the cycles of war and peace that litter world history happened? There are nature's laws and there are man's laws and that's it. The freedom for every individual provided by nature or the slavery of the same provided by man.

Tom Osborne, good observation and I agree. It is also exactly why they always fail in the long run, they really are no greater than anyone else.

"Those people who will not be governed by God (moral compasses) will be ruled by tyrants." William Penn. (parenthesis mine.)--------------- "Only a virtuous people are capable of freedom. As nations become corrupt and vicious, they have more need of masters,(external control by despots"). Benjamin Franklin. (paranthesis mine).

Mike, you nailed it as well when you said "Nobility of life is now being terminated by applied eugenics, putting a dollar value to life.." People have been taught over time and learned over the same period, by those who do not respect the lives of other's at all but do respect the almighty dollar, to think the same way as they do and now that the perpetual debt system is in place, even if an individual chooses to place life above the dollar it is next to impossible to do it because the system doesn't allow for that. In order to survive most are virtually trapped into this system and are along for the ride because jumping off and being free of its entanglements (contracts) still leaves one dragged along by those entanglements. Elite selfishness at the expense of the lives of all individuals plays on and off the instinctual selfishness that causes man to, in order to feed himself, work. Of course work entails a means of exchange so there is no jumping free of the system now in place. Plain and simple we need to place individual (everybody's) life back in its place as the most valued and respected creation in existence which is exactly the position the elite have kept their lives in while full well acknowledging, by their actions, that our lives and the rest of the world's are meaningless to them but for the labor (wealth) they can extract from the life that produces it.

J Carlton, just a thought, when the people were tending toward apathy the mainstream media was their gospel but now that they are waking up (tea parties etc), the mainstream is fast becoming the fringe.

Waffler, it's the word enFORCEment where the crime lies because in a free America, an individual cannot be FORCED to do anything unless he violates (endangers the free exercise of) the right of another, ANYTHING!

It is the word "force" that is key here. National sovereignty in America cannot be separated from individual sovereignty as that was the essential ingredient that created our America with the writing of the Constitution. Individual sovereignty, freedom and in particular freedom of choice is what Americans are being "forced" into giving up for the sake of this NWO. Force, by its nature, precludes any freedom to choose. Kissinger knows what he says is true as he has and is one of the elite selling out American freedom for the dictates of the NWO.

I'd love to hear Wafflers take on this. How about it Waffler, maybe we need some laws requiring a certain amount of apathy and uninvolvement and set up a bureaucracy (by borrowing more debt) to make sure the American individuals and groups that are causing the excess of democracy are shut out therefore alleviating "some" of the problems of governance in the United States today. My jaw drops and my head shakes when I think that some, many even, believe this clap trap of double speak that is, in todays intellectual world, words of wisdom so far ahead of the simple mind of the average individual he is not expected to understand so don't bother and just go back to what you were doing and we'll do what we do, your life is well in our hands. Talk about vaguery in saying a lot of nothing and these groups (CFR and TC), and others like them are shaping the world they expect us to live in. By doing nothing, this is what people ask for.

Religions are the worst of the culprits and Judaism and christianity in particular. The O.T. contains the message of how to achieve world peace that the Israelites didn't, as they were supposed to, share with the rest of the world and the christians of today know the message (Jesus did the job the Israelites didn't) but are told to wait, it is a spiritual thing and never consider His "will be done on earth as it is in heaven" nor the the fact Jesus said what you do on earth will be done in heaven. This is the root of our problems, there are too many good people out there doing nothing unless they are pushed to do something by the ever rising abuses government is committing against them and then only when it becomes a personal issue. This is understandable once one realizes the purity and simpleness of the messages given over time have been corrupted, bent and twisted to suit those who would, in ignorance of the message, enslave men rather than set them free. A convention of religious truthsayers, five stars for what they said and no stars for the current religious conventions of today that really only squabble over who can get the most followers and their money. They mock the message of peace and love they say they represent and tell all to wait for Jesus to return and sort it all out. Well damn folks, if I was the devil I'd be patting all these religious leaders on the back and saying thank you, you serve me well.

National security gives them the excuse to cover up anything they want. You're the only one that is not allowed to have any secrets and once the "chipped" cash or the cashless society appears you will have no secrets that can be covered up even if "secrets" are personal problems and secrets within your own family and even though not criminal, are still considered private and therefore secret. With "chipped" cash or a cashless society with a chipped I.D. card or an implanted chip within the body, our government will be the only one able to keep secrets. Funny how they agree to more transparency and in the little more they do show I have to wonder how many more secrets they are creating and keeping to keep the subjects, that which we are now, in the dark. Hmmm.

Waffler, it's like I said, there's nothing wrong with free enterprise and the owners having the right of privacy as long as the buisness being done doesn't violate the rights of one individual without his uncoerced willing consent. It's simple, violate a right, commit a crime. You know as well as I do Archer complains about the system of money we use thus his complaint about the money masters who plunder everybody and use their control over centralized corporations to destroy free enterprise where capitalism has its roots. Corporatism should be outlawed as it is a foreign jurisdicition of laws existing in America and as such a threat to freedom.

Waffler, if anybody's plans whether the individual, a small mom and pop business, a huge corporation or the administrations of men hired on as servants to protect the natural rights of the individual, violates just one right when they are "seeking to maximize their bottom line" and that is criminal activity and of course the right to their privacy unless they get caught. Evidence of crime justifies the right to intrude on privacy rights except you can't even get our government to audit the Fed can we? The thumbs down is for your insistence to ignore the truth as well as the quote.

Economics 101 for the elite banker wannabe.

RBESRQ, if Satan himself had said these words I still would give the quote 5 stars.

Waffler, in life you are either a user or used because freedom calls for people who are non users and slavery calls for people who are users. Some say the users of the new world order will finally bring peace with constant war against those who break their version of peaceful enslavement of the world such as the willing European countries are embracing now along with Canada and Australia. I say it can't so therefore won't work because the respect of individual life is not important to the success of the world achievement of peace at the end of a barrel. Fact of history and human nature, if you don't respect them (peoples lives), you'll never have peace.

Life is really pretty simple when you filter through all the flak out there to cover up the simplicity of it. I agree with you Jim K.

Welcome to the perpetual debt nation of America 2009. Sam would have a heart attack if he were here today.

Sounds like an apt description of England's government, but how it affects us here and now I don't see it.

And I thought it was supposed to be an association of the people who lived in the different States. Isn't that why individual rights were given supreme authority over not only the Federal administration but over the States as well? I suppose I could be missing something here so I'll wait to see the other opinions that get posted. Waffler, why don't you explain the difference you pointed out? It kind of left me hanging as to what you meant and why you said it. I'll leave the rating out for now.

As long as we're having fun, shucks Mike, I guess I'll just have to work harder to catch up to you.

Sorry Waff, in return you can call me anything you want including those words I'm sure are descriptive that have entered your thoughts. I can't help it, it's only rarely I can take you seriously and the rest of the time you make me laugh.LOL.

J Carlton, I agree with your assessment of Waff's post. It's definitely not worth addressing but was worth the response you gave it.

Lol. Oh Oh, Waff is getting mad again proving the truth of the statement "the truth hurts."

Hat tip to J Carlton and E.Archer. J., you really did nail it with the Stockholm Syndrome line. A light went on bright and clear in my mind after that one. Well said.

Yes Waff, we already know you live in the land of democracy and your description of self rule, at least where it pertains to our Constitution makes me glad you don't write the history books. As J.B.Wuff said, and I hope I understand him correctly, divine right of the individual to rule himself was and is the experiment in progress and thus why our founders called it a great experiment to see if man could really rule over himself.