After reading some of the stuff you write, Waffler, I'd have to advise you not to underestimate how much others know. For a while, I wasn't sure if you really believed the stuff you wrote, or you were really smarter than that and were just playing the antagonist. I'm well aware of the attributes of debt, public and private. I also know what happens when the debtor runs out of ways to pay. The good faith and credit of the US Federal Government is running out. When they tried to impose a protectionist tariff just a couple of weeks ago, China threatened to stop buying up our debt. It was sufficient to make the Fed gov back down. You need to consider what will happen when the value of our currency drops to the point where foreign governments are no longer willing to buy. China has already slowed its purchases. What's the next step? Declare national bankruptcy and renege on the debt? Give them California?

"Germany was a dictatorship not a consensus of opinion." That's not a completely accurate statement. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_election,_1933 http://www.fff.org/freedom/fd0403a.asp

"Prices in a free economy are seldom static." I found a grain of truth! But then we get, "One thing worse than inflation is deflation, when you buy something and the next day it is worth less than you paid for." This, as Comrade Waffler would say, is BS. It's the same equation turned on its head as saying, ' One thing worse that deflation is inflation, when you get your paycheck and the next day it buys less goods and services than you worked for.' Whether deflation, [sic] is good or bad is irrelevant. It is the natural and inevitable correction to an increase in the supply of money. It is also important to keep in mind that inflation is defined as an increase in the supply of money. It is NOT a general increase in prices. The general increase in prices is a symptom of inflation. By that same token, deflation is a contraction of the money supply, not a decrease in prices. And, yes. It does make a difference whether you understand it or not.

"Any economist will tell you that a 2-4% rate of price inflation is normal and healthy." Actually, that should read "Any Keynesian economist..." although the term is oxymoronic. And, when the government spends more than it taxes it actually does run the presses, that's where the figure for M3 comes from. The fact that they they then sell that debt to foreign governments is why it is also debt. Regardless of the prestidigitation involved, it is still the creation of money without the backing of productive wealth. I tried to find some information on the claim that "car sales were the best in almost a year", but even from resources as recent as 2/13/09 @ 4PM EST all have statements to this affect: "But the core problem they faced in December -- too few buyers -- has only worsened, making their prospects look even dimmer in coming months. U.S. auto sales plunged 37 percent in January to the slowest pace since 1982." Retail figures show a rise of 1% in January, the first rise in seven months. But that sales are down 9.7% compared to January 2007 levels. Fuel sales went up 3%, but it shouldn't take Albert Einstein to figure out the reason for that one. Yep, historically it's cyclical and mankind survives, but that's not much of a consolation to the generation that has to pick up the tab for the previous generation's excesses. In his classic 1946 book Economics in One Lesson -- an amazingly clear and eye-opening introduction to free-market economics -- Henry Hazlitt described the "one lesson" required for good economics: "The art of economics consists in looking not merely at the immediate but at the longer effect of any act or policy; it consists in tracing the consequences of that policy not merely for one group but for all groups." The basic message: think long-term. Most of today's economists have never learned Hazlitt's one lesson. Instead, they are followers of his more famous contemporary, John Maynard Keynes, whose philosophy was expressed in his famous quip that, "In the long run, we'll all be dead." Based on such shallow wisdom, today's economists feel free to ignore anything but the shortest of short-term consequences.

There are always two sides to every violation of rights. The violated who has suffered a loss of life, liberty or property will rightfully complain. The violator is never short of rationalizations for his actions. Whatever Waffler did to receive his wealth, it's obvious he was on the side of the violators and not the violated. Buck up. What's that, newspeak for bend over?

We can fathom the 'law of large numbers', but most of us here seem to have been able to think past it. Maybe, one day, if you study, you will, too.

Washington wasn't referring to 'illegal' counterfeiting. It is true that the Continental was easily counterfeited, but that was a small fraction of the problem. The Continental was printed to finance the revolution and the majority of the inflation at the behest of the Continental Congress. Hyper-inflation caused a devaluation of the Continental to the point where "not worth a Continental" was a common phrase and troops paid in the script were using it to line their boots. Rhode Island inflated the currency at the highest rate and was hardest hit by the effect. By the end of 1781, $16,800 of the paper money would purchase only $100 in specie.

Mike hit the nail on the head. The privilege afforded special interests, (including the military/industrial complex), can only be financed through taxation or inflation. The state loves inflation because if they taxed us outright for all of their bombs and benevolence we'd be coming for them with pitchforks and torches. The whole system is based on the game 'musical chairs.' Those in power walk around and promise their constituents something for nothing and hope that someone else is in power when the music stops. Inflation cannot stave off the inevitable forever. The pitchforks and torches are coming.

Humans are slow learners. "Money" isn't always money and doesn't always equal wealth. The people of Zimbabwe have lots of "money." Throw a little fractional reserve banking into the cauldron and you have a witch's brew that will turn a princely economy into a toad.

"I can think of no country in the world that it, [fiat currency], is not used." That, my socialist friend, is Gresham's law hard at work.

No, Waffler. Your messed up concept of rights is what leads you to believe that states can grant rights. Rights are inherent and cannot be granted by other humans. That's an attribute of rights and what sets them apart from privileges, (legitimate or illegitimate), which can be granted by humans and human institutions. Individuals already have the right to incorporate. Either the state merely recognizes that right, or it violates that right through licensure and regulation and then grants privilege to those willing to jump through their hoops.

States don't, and can't, GIVE rights.

Only the educated are free. http://www.thefreemanonline.org/columns/the-constitution-and-paper-money/ http://www.fff.org/freedom/fd0608a.asp

This reminds me of people who will say, "The Constitution doesn't give you the right to do 'X'. The Constitution doesn't GIVE you the right to do anything. Rights are yours already and cannot be granted by men or governments. Nor does the exclusion of any action from the Bill of Rights mean that you don't have that right. The US Constitution, for all practical purposes, is just the Federal Government's job description and the things it's allowed to do are few and enumerated.

We have forgotten the difference between laws, which are immutable and "laws" which are written by men.

The Constitution provides as much protection as one of those paper toilet seat covers to individuals who are ignorant or apathetic about rights.

"It is safer to follow the consensus of opinion,..." "In Germany, they came first for the Communists, And I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a Communist; And then they came for the trade unionists, And I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a trade unionist; And then they came for the Jews, And I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a Jew; And then . . . they came for me . . . And by that time there was no one left to speak up." Your rights are more important to me, than my safety. As for "wacko organizations"...All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.

Much of what we enjoy in the US today isn't real wealth, (the product of or labor), it's debt and economic prestidigitation, and the bill will come due. It is historically accurate that mankind has survived, it has done so despite plunder, not because of it, and while some may be perfectly happy to just survive, some would like to improve our standard of living AND leave the situation better for our progeny. I have a son, so at this point, just leaving the place better for him will have to suffice. That means not leaving trillions of dollars worth of debt for him to pay. This eat drink and be merry, and leave the bill for our kids mentality is the epitome of selfishness and greed.

Have any of you seen the Youtube video, "Money, Banking and the Federal Reserve"? It has some interesting stuff in it.

The word 'guarantee' only appears in the US Constitution once - "The United States shall guarantee to every state in this union a republican form of government, and shall protect each of them against invasion; and on application of the legislature, or of the executive (when the legislature cannot be convened) against domestic violence." (Apparently, domestic violence perpetrated by those in government is exempt.)

Population increase is one of our main problems. As is always the case in socialist societies where the responsibility and cost of having children is abdicated to "society." It's easy to have eight kids when you don't have to pay for them. As for how much of our money the government spends on TARP Vs. empire, I'd say the correct answer is, "Who cares." Both represent expenditures of stolen money which will reap negative long term consequences. How many times does history have to repeat itself before we catch on?
http://www.lewrockwell.com/bonner/bonner357.html
http://mises.org/article.aspx?Id=1419

What's missing is a definition of money as a medium of exchange and an objective assessment of the positive and negative attributes of various substances in fulfilling that role. One positive attribute is a relatively fixed value relative to other goods and services. Precious metals fulfill that role well. Consider, for example, that one ounce of gold will still purchase about the same goods or services today that it would in the late 1800s. A negative attribute is the ease in which a medium of exchange can be manipulated, such as in counterfeiting. Legitimately or illegitimately is irrelevant. The result is still a gain for those who expand the supply and a loss for those use the inflated medium. Honest money should be a measure of value. Just like one cup of flour should always be no more or no less. If you went to the butcher shop only to discover that a pound of meat, which was 16 ounces two weeks ago, and 14 ounces last week, was 12 ounces this week, you would call him a thief and rightly so. It should be the same when the Fed creates and devalues currency. Precious metals are still being discovered and mined, but there's much more capital, (time, energy and equipment), expended in that process than there is at the Fed's presses and much less precious metals found than dollars printed, which is why the value of the dollar has declined relative to gold. It took only $20 to buy an ounce of gold in the 1800s. Today you must have about $900 to buy that same ounce. As I said, it's not that the value of gold has risen relative to other goods and services, but that the value of the dollar has fallen. It'll be that way until alchemy becomes a reality.

"Societies have existed successfully for thousands of years without Gold." As they also did without modern medicine, electricity, cutlery and indoor plumbing. However, I don't believe the fact that they did so equates to a better state of being. Perhaps some would prefer that we still be sickly, defecate in the woods, in the dark and eat with our fingers.

"The US Dollar is the preferred currency around the world." Waffler "Of all things, I should imagine you could not possibly feel nervous on the Titanic. Why, the boat is absolutely unsinkable." White Star Lines booking agent

"Whatever the majority says in a democracy is sacrosanct within the limits of the Bill of Rights." Only if you've been fooled into accepting the legitimacy of democracy or that your rights are limited to those listed in the Bill of Rights. "When I say rights," Waffler said in rather a scornful tone, "they mean just what I choose for them to mean -- neither more nor less."