When I listen to speeches by Ron Paul, as in the last POTUS debates, all I hear is applause in the background; none for most of what the others say, as I do today. He may be our last chance, and Kucinich may fade faster if they get rid of his seat (was he napping; too bad, she would make a great first lady). Lord Acton rolling in his grave on this one !

I can only hope that the rest of you are NOT in favor of Hillary and her destructive tendancies as in evidence presently, and to her would-be world-wide gun-grab if she became POTUS ! ...and I'm afraid Bill is wth her on this; lost it for him with NAFTA and loss of Glass-Steagal.

I have always hoped to see such people be more attuned to presenting a more balanced and varied view of civil rights possibilities, with each case being given unique status and proper scurtiny such that it would be evident to most as to the underlying nature of the intent to either try to advance or denigrate mankind, but such is not the case with this man, nor with those who are as totally "libertarian" IMO, being divorced from society, while taking protection and sustenance from it, divided already and therefore easy to conquer, and often just plain too selfish to have any real friends...let alone successful family, or country !

Glad to see you are all on target with the good 'ol IRS/16th/"Federal reserve" criminals (IMO also); just testing the waters. If enough of us get on board, as with the RPs, Kucinich (111th, HR6550), Sanders etal., there might be a chance to save the nation, sorta. I just couldn't miss the chance to condemn the fact that the IRS only picks on "we the little people", just as JP Morgan, GS, Rockefelers, etal. intended. Am studying Eliz. Warren, brave, smart, truly American lady who may make a difference. Not sure how the double entry thing is happening.

The Swiss are just pulling a bait and switch with such a statement to explain their high "income" levels. They simply are the world's money "stash" to hide from taxes, etc. and enough rubs off on them as that kind of "chosen" people. Non-agression? Who wants to try to conquer a country of such mountains; we're having trouble enough in Afghanistan; besides, it's been set up as a super-playground for the rich anyway, who wouldn't "allow" war there...might even find that the height of some of those mountains is due to "gold props" holding them up ! I hope the IRS keeps up the pressure on such off-shore tax evasions, but also extends it to the super-rich, not just some of we upper-middle types (really, "wine lot" tax evasion?; what else next?).

Mike, I had to google "social security act of 1913 " myself, not being sure of the date of enactment, but found it was 1935...but the section "1913" is used in reference to hospitals in the link below. http://www.ssa.gov/OP_Home/ssact/title19/1913.htm

...and it's big companion, the "Federal Reserve" act of 1913, allowing private banks to create money and lend it to the government as if they earned it, but actually "legally" counterfeited it to our total detriment of now over $14 trillion, unpayable, and therefore a ponzi scheme/fraud by any legal standard. Congress has the power to do away with it still as it always has, but you don't see anyone jumping on that do you:? I esp. admire the RPs and most esp. Kuciinich for his 111th bill HR6550 to pay it all of with a TARP/QE2- like sum of government "generated" money, for which there would never again be a "national debt" (let alone the interest, which is how the real money is "made" and transfered to "undisclosed locations" in Europe, like UBS?...Gramm is enjoying his retirement/ reward job there for doing away with the Glass-Steagal act, which should instead be reinstated world-wide). Money created as debt must leave the planet forever ! GNP money or nothing...let the chinese buy gold at over $100k/oz and be done with it, as it's just a "nice" commodity in the GNP anyway. Have you read Louis T McFadden yet?

I would have it that collective bargaining is a more appropriate mindset and circumstance for the private sector, where there is PRIVATE PROFIT potential, such that workers can negotiate for more of a share of that profit; but in the sector of public jobs, they are always a drain on society as a rule without largess of industry and must be made as efficient as possible to support the profit sector with serevices and minor products not available otherwise. This includes the MIC IMO. The only way the public employees could voice such requests would be in response to the direction society was headed; in prosperous private sector times, they could "ask" for more pay and benefits, but might not get them, and the reverse as things stand today... and they should expect that if they understand that in more or less "guaranteeing" that their "sector" will never go bankrupt, they give up the privilege of making larger gains as is the chance the private sector makes. pretty basic stuff.

For me it is the choice of being Libertarian or libertine; an interhumanitarian moral base is necessary lest we all become islands, uninvolved and uncaring of each other, already divided and therefore easy to conquer. Positive human interraction is absolutely necessary for a successful society...or you end up with what we are seeing happen now right before our eyes, with Wisconson being the starting bell of a fight we will all lose as middle-classers. the good of the nation, through honoring the work ethic and the golden rule are good starts, both of which seem to be NOT in evidence as both sides of that issue fight amongst themselves, as intended by non-caring absconding, TARP unprosecuted, super-rich, expatriots to "undisclosed locations". I fear for the country and the very ideals it once promised as rough but delicate the balances in human frailty they represent are.

Sedition and (unarmed) insurrection are a must to save the country. We must stop fighting each other as in Wisconson and concentrate on where the problems are coming from...the super-rich who have, without penalty, super-capital flighted, off-shored, outsourced and expatriated to "undisclosed locations" around the world. International law anyone...NOT international gun grabbing for starters, how about TARP prosecutions and reinstituting the Glass-Steagal act...world-wide?..on and on.

MIke, but statutory law, (over civil)does right? Most genocides, progroms, diasperas have been preceded by gun grabbing governments to my knowledge. Missed yesterday; storm; going there now.

I must study the "2 enumerations"

Mike, if Neutimer runs and wins, our fears will be fulfilled for such a statist future, esp. with the likes of Hillary's UN gun-grab, artificial and real oil, food, commoditity price hikes plus tax increases with higher unemployment, militarism unchecked; I'm not very encouraged about our futures...posse comitatus anyone ? JC - yes, banksters and I have almost given up on the RPs; this year it's HR459; who knows? I hope Kucinich doesn't get gerrymandersed out of a seat so he can reintroduce his well co-supported HR6550 from the 111th...talk about a BOLD dose of the Fed's own medicine ! Government money, like the chinese have, would be quite welcome to me, IF there were a BBA and/or state's powers of nullification to prevent deficits except in times of dire emergecy as overtly declared by congress, not as now with the unending oxymoronic WOT; also with a GNP loosely based dollar to prevent inflation/deflation; but of course we'd never see anything like that, as TFTB would not be able to print TARP or QE2 monies as well as foisting the mess on the US public.

You're both right IMO; and to what end has this transition to interhumanitarian alientation and despondency been perpetrated for ? Total hegemonic control of automatonic populations of the earth to "wreak" the will of the despots, as in Afghanistan, and soon Lybia or Iran, etal.? Even Wisconson "wreaks" of such cabal infestation with a totally transparent, abhorent governor who could have stated things much more differently than to condemn the teachers outright. They also, could have set an example for the country..and the world if they were more "informed" as to the nature of the miscreant cabal eroding every nitch of our existance, more and more every day; for the time I will forgive any them of impertinent selfish motives, but we all must learn to cooperate and find ways to rid ourselves of the tyranny we labor under.

Amen, Mike; it's pretty straightforward fraud by most legal definitions...and you don't see any Constitutional lawyers on the case do you ? All scared, unconcerned, as they are "allowed" a goodly income and could care less, being totally "selfish-ists" themselves, or scared to death by the Fed & co. if they try to do something for "we the little people". I wish I could talk to Judy Preska, Manhatten Fed district (cv09595), or Brooksley Born on derivatives, but they have long since "left the building" for parts unknown, or just been somehow "silenced". The "legal", but immoral, unconstitutional, totally usurious to ruination Fed act of 1913 must be repealed and it's entire proceeds confiscated with international subpoenas, grand juries, convictions, jail sentences, forfiture and declarations of world-wide negation aimed at making sure no body of men ever again can declare debt to be money, having been counterfeited into existance as Wilson "noted" in his deathbed confession, that he had "ruined" the country due to his "ignorance" in signing it, after being rewarded for the effort by having his picture adorn the $100k bill...none of which are in circulation today, having been "recalled" for some reason...a little too obvious perhaps? As Ron and Rand Paul, Dennis Kucinich, Bernie Sanders, etal. have stated, the "Fed" and it's kind must GO, forever.

Deficits only get it partly "right" when it comes to the money supply vs GNP. Yes, new money, generated by the government, that is OWNED by the US government with NO national debt incurred, should just be put into circulation to loosely "track" the GNP, taking into account the need for new loans for startups, etc. as our country did before the Revolution (the colonial scrip) and as was the reason for our Revolution when the British forced us to use the pound sterling, which they "loaned" to us to start banks, "at only 6% interest"...but a deflection as the real problem being paying back principle ! Hamilton bought into this big time and started the band of NY...which the British still own today ! During the Revolution, the continental of Ben Franklin did just fine until after when the Brits counterfeited it well enough to end it's use...the first time in history a currency funded a country's beginnings ! (maybe?) The real way you get into trouble with deficits is when money is "generated" with no GNP increase IMO...like now with TARP, QE2 and endless deficits which we will all be caught up in shortly as after Wisconson, the government takes over funding for everything it can grab in retirement accounts, etc., then starts lowering payouts...frogs in a warming pot again.

Yes, but what can we do about it but to elect those few who may do something ? I fear that Wisconson is but the first of many shoes to drop before entitlements go the same way, regardless of merit, contribution levels, etc. I would love to see Bush be extradited from Paraguay instead of just being threatened by the Swiss for war crimes trial. Does he really have his own personal military protection force (like Petraeus and the ISAF..used to be NATO, coalition of the willing, etc.) and airstrip with 500 troops on the ground?

Yes, at least after overseeing the treaty of Versailles, he was quite properly concerned that he had just set up the next war, which he of course had, which must have added to his personal sense of monetary power mongering and "laisse faire" attitude (actually cavalier) toward the masses of the world that his tyrannical adherents could affect/infect through the "money created as debt" crowd, having just succeeded in duping the world through the Fed act of 1913 (in response to the engineered panic of 1907 ala JPM). At least the ranchers and miners of North Dakota had enough sense to rid themselves of these bilker-crats by establishing public banking there in 1919 as a total response to the possiblility of being "duped" as well. I wonder if that's why Arnold left the building, since now even Calif. and a few other states are contemplating saving their bacon with this move. BOND is the only state run bank in the country and is and has been solvent since it's beginnings so many years ago. There is hope if enough brave souls at the right levels of state government jump on before the train goes over the cliff perhaps? ...and I LOVE the boldness of some like Kucinich with his 111th HR6550 to rid the country of the entire national debt.... by printing TARP-like funds ! He WILL be THE genius in my book if he can pull off something like that. I fear that Ron Paul is too old to be effective...that's why he is let run amok so to speak, BUT I will support his candidacy if it comes to that. Who else do we have ?

Seditious speech (no longer a crime, legislated long ago) aimed at (unarmed) insurrection is exactly what Wisconson is all about...that is NOT a violent nor bad thing, nor are these bad terms aimed at bad people. These good American teachers are just the first to suffer from measures which just skirt around the corners of the Constitution's first amendment right to redress of grievance in deference to the "legal" (Fed act of 1913), immoral (usurious, esp. when the fed bank rate is high, eg. 20% back in the 70's AND printing money from thin air...counterfeiting), unconstitutional, fraudulent (by any legal definition, unpayable) national debt IMO. Public opinion, however is another matter when it comes to public servants, and I heartily agree that if there are cuts to be made somewhere in the country, the public servants are the first to go down that road; all our government agencies are too big anyway, including, esp. the military. The real problem is what to do with all the newly unemployed if Ron Paul does win in '12, which I have not seen (or missed?) him speaking to. We really need to undo much of the last 30 years of "undoing of the middle class", lest we all become troglodytes of the tyrants in Washington and wallstreet. I wonder whatever happened to cause judge Preska's reversal of decision to fully audit the NY Fed, and Brooksley Born's warnings about derivatives back in '98 ? These heroines have been long forgotten apparently, and I'm in the wrong field to pursue such travesties of political repartee and substance.

To Mike, Norwalk; " what modified definition of capitalism are you using > You seem to have definitions down pretty well in your first post. Our "cronie-capitalism" is one of the worst, just short of a Lybian style dictatorship as we are seeing. The pure Libertarian capitalism of the Paul's is too much for me to accept completely, but some better, as it only suffers from neglect of fellow countrymen, anarchic monetarism and lack of mutual aid in dire times; they are already divided and therefore easier to conquer.

You two may be right of course, but you sound sound like the status-quo crowd, I am neither left nor right. Out of control, wreckless, morally bankrupt captialism has caused the mess we're in now. A certain safe, minimal, carefully tended set of regulations must save any nation from the excesses of either management or labor IMO. TFTB are just smarter than to enact actual genocide or total dictatorial powers so far, as wallstreet continues to destroy America for it's own sake in the manner of the frog in the warming pot, and as china devours the world, with "offshore" investiture ala Americana hyper-rich, and which the wallsneeks feel they will be above with TARP, QE2 and beyond as well as disastrously outpacing "we the little people" when it's all over...like Bush in Paraguay, or D. Rockefeller with his book on Amazon with their NWO-speak or SCOTUS with it's absolutely devastating rulings on things like campaign contributions by corporate entities, even foreign, let alone the long overdue change in the "correctness" of corporate personhood . I want NAFTA, CAFTA, Fannie/Freddie/Frank, etal. gone; we need Glass-Steagal back...worldwide and habeas corpus for starters, let alone posse comitatus guarantees, and a general respect and reinstatement of the Constitution...before the military realizes they have been "cooked" as above; then down size everything including the military (MIIC) with "incentives" to get the capital flight crowd to come back and begin rebuilding a more competitve manufacturing nation to put all the newly unemployed militaries and former government workers to new jobs or suffer with international extradition, forfiture, indictment, jail, etc if they try and abscond or renig, not just the new offshore reporting requirements for the IRS....for us little people only. Also with workers who understand new limitations on wages with this long-past WWII world they bloatingly relished for so long. Or, we can simply let Wisconson-like events begin all over the country and let it be pared down to a tyrant/trogledyte state, totally spartan for the sake of wallstreet, the Fed bunch, IMF, WB, UBS (Gramm enjoying his cushy retirement cubicle for getting rid of the GS act?). The world we knew as "American" is almost gone; the great sucking sound of Ross Perot rules in it's stead and I will do what I can to leave a better world for ALL who would be truly "American", as it's imperfect beginnings (and for 200 years) have captivated the world's attentions and affections as the best way forward for humanity to date. We must heed judges Preska and Born, etal. on these dangers and others soon or it will end badly, perhaps like Greece or the ME? If Hitler hadn't been so stupid as to blame an ethnic group for Germany's woes, and minimized the individual, he might have been remembered much differently IMO.

Another puppet I cannot respect, esp. in regard to regulation; witness the fall of Glass-Steagal and it's culminating debacle of 07-08. Judges Brooksley Born tried to warn of derivatives and Judy Preska was forced to stop her full audit of the Fed "for some reason"... sounds like somebody's "regulations" had been broken ! ...Seems funny to me that somehow Glass-Steagal worked when it was in force ? THOSE people I wish I knew of.

I don't respect anything this puppet said, esp. in regard to regulation; witness the fall of Glass-Steagal and it's culminating debacle of 07-08. Judges Brooksley Born tried to warn of derivatives and Judy Preska was forced to stop her full audit of the Fed "for some reason"... sounds like somebody's "regulations" had been broken !

It's quite sad to reflect generally on the long history of mankind as being replete with examples as he alludes to, and esp. when today, we have a chance to change that attitude for something better to generally benefit all mankind at least once in a while to whatever extent we ourselves might choose; but as we know, those at the top are committing acts, just as he says, in the most adulterous ways they can as our liberties and livelihoods are increasingly taken from us and our progeny.

Obama's to be gone soon... Carnegie won though, right? didn't he and his steel buddies own the Johnstown dam that burst killing so many... those were piratical days, ..just like today on wallsneek ! Where are the TARP prosecutions ?..and what happened to judges Brooksley Born (derivatives '99), and Judy Preska (NY Fed, cv09595) ? We don't have a country anymore, it is a faschist state like Hamilton wanted all along, but we don't have an Adams or Jefferson or Franklin to save us this tiime, unless one of you can do it; I'm too much in debt thanks to "their" fiat money scheme...maybe Kuciinich (HR6550)?, or Bernie..(jaw dropping) might help Ron Paul, but I won't hold my breath; maybe the only reason he's still alive,unlike others is that he isn't very capable like the rest of the Lew Rockwell bunch ? (but I wish they were of course).