“The greatest danger to liberty today comes from the men who are most needed and most powerful in modern government, namely, the efficient expert administrators exclusively concerned with what they regard as the public good.”

Reminds of the current complaint about Obama. He is being criticized for pointing out the problems and profilgacy of the last eight years. There are those it seems who would just like to continue wallowing in their misconception about :"liberty" while our nation and society drifts deeper into doodoo. True liberty must include honesty with ourselves and each other. Obama brings this! Hayk points out the dilemma of self government. It would be better if these things were somehow accomplished naturally or automatically but what Hayek is saying here is that these efficient expert adminstrators are needed. If each and all of us governed ourselves properly fewer of thses "experts" would be needed. (If people did their taxes properly we could layoff the IRS.)

As usual, Komrad Waffler makes no sense. All the plundering and thievery by the government is always done for the "public good". If you can read past a 3rd grade level, it is obvious that Hayek is NOT saying that these "experts" are needed, quite the opposite.

Do you really believe the debt payment enforcement arm of the international loan sharks would be laid off? LMAO. Hayek mentioned the threat to liberty by these people. The reason they are needed is because the banking elite have finally trapped us in the pepetual debt to them syndrome. In order for people to get something to spend on their loaf of bread the government and people must borrow it to get something to spend into circulation. Utter dependence on a government that gives lip service to the rights and freedom of individuals in America. LMAO.

Waffler That's the difference between you and most everyone else who visits this site, You think the IRS is doing us all a favor. Why can't you see that all the paperwork and regulations on how to "properly do your taxes" is a result of too much government, that the infrastructure of the IRS is the problem not the solution.

Yes, Hayek here is referring to the "general welfare" of the US citizens which has so clearly been watered down and abused that the average person has no clue what it is anymore. When you ask someone to take care of you, you better know their motives...

Obidiance to law allows for a reduction in law enforcement. Less crime less cops. More self government less law enforcement. If all folks paid their taxes properly the debt would come down by 300 billion a year and the IRS enforcement arm could be laid off! A substantial improvement in self government. The law is enacted by us through our elected representatives. Let us follow the laws we have enacted freely as a free and honorable people.

How is it that the 'public good' now equates to the majority of individuals detriment? Waffler, you opps again. "Obedience to law allows for a reduction in law enforcement." That in and of itself is a true statement but, the problem here begins with your definition of law. The foundational jurisprudence of the original, now lost, USA was the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God, or natural law if you will. The despotic rule of men, which you so lovingly and admiringly call law (anti-law in fact - honored only by the abject malfeasant) is contrary to the nobility of life, freedom, liberty, inalienable rights, alodium, etc. "Any single man must judge for himself whether circumstances warrant obedience or resistance to the commands of the civil magistrate; we are all qualified, entitled, and morally obliged to evaluate the conduct of our rulers. This political judgment, moreover, is not simply or primarily a right, but like self-preservation, a duty to God. As such it is a judgment that men cannot part with according to the God of Nature. It is the first and foremost of our inalienable rights without which we can preserve no other." (John Locke, 632 - 1704) Further, the greater the criminal and civil unrest due to despotic anti-law rule demands more efficient expert administrators (cops) exclusively concerned with what they regard as the public good. Let us construct our codes, ordinances, regulations, rules, statutes, etc in harmony with the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God and we will be a free and honorable people.

Very well said Mike. Waffler, where did you get the figures for for the 300 billion claim. Is there a site somewhere that tracks those that don't pay their taxes properly? Who are they and are any of them in prison yet? Such criminals should be locked away, yes? If not, I'm sure the IRS would hire such as yourself to teach people like that to pay their taxes properly so we can layoff the IRS. You sure bring out the patriotism in me Waffler. I think I'll give the IRS more money so we can lay them off faster.

Waffler won't admit it but he made his living in the tax business, so he knows upon which side his bread is buttered. Don't try to make sense of his comments -- circular logic and collectivist jargon mostly. This quote is about him! Well, said, Mike. Congress makes more and more laws, and adds more and more 'officers' to the payroll to enforce them. Somehow government 'people' can be trusted more than regular 'people' -- I sure wish I knew how they were able to hire only the 'good' ones...

I afraid that Waffler is going to discover that Obama is the least likely of recent presidents to bring honesty to bear on himself or on the citizens of this nation. There is a word that applies to people who think they know what is good for the public and it is not spelled Liberty.

Anon I will report back to you but for starters go to IRS.com. The estimated underpayment of income taxes is a public figure. The Fed Budget runs around 3 trillion lately and the Feds are actually cheated out of somewhere in the range of 200 to 300 Billion. Try goodling "fed cheat factor" or something like that. I will report back if I get a more exact figure. But it is easy to see that 200 or 300 Billion a year adds up to a lot of National Debt.

Most people complain about the inefficiency of government, but they don't realize there is nothing more to be feared than an efficient bureaucrat.

Anon you can find info about the Tax Gap at "usgovinfo.about.com/od/smallbusiness/a/taxgap.htm". The best thing we can do about is to write to our Congrssmen and Senators and tell them to close it. The only way to close it is to demand more enforcement. Increasing tax rates slightly and closing the tax gap of $350 billion annually will go a long way towards our nations financial health. There are only two types of bureaucrats: the lazy stupid one, and the efficient proficient one, take your pick.

Waffler, you blundering ignoramus. Do you even know who Hayek is? Your initial comment concerning what you THINK Hayek said is -- if it wasn't so tragically misconstrued -- actually kind of laughable. I've been reading over several of your comments lately, and I'm having a mental relapse -- I've got to stop reading your comments for fear of becoming mentally challenged myself. Why, for once, don't you stop talking and start reading; why don't you actually hop onto Mises.org and actually listen to some Hayek or Mises and figure out what they're saying instead of continuing to spew your stupidity over the internet? Your understanding of monetary policy is so capriciously ignorant, that, once again, I don't know where to actually start to pinpoint your stupidity... You have no idea what anyone here is talking about, but instead of trying to figure it out you merely assert your own unintelligent opinion and continue to use a strawman against everyone else. You're the king of fallacies. You can tax 100% of people's money and spend $0 dollars, and you'll never be able to pay back the national debt... Think about that one for more than two seconds, and then get back to us. If you can't figure it out (which you won't, and won't bother to), I'd suggest hopping on mises.org and start reading.

Good to hear from you Logan. Glad to see that you are your same miserable self. You should get together with JT form Florida who criticizes my research and says that Washington resigned the Presiden and served less than his full 8 years. Broadsides and diatribes like yours Logan are not becoming at all. Not at all. Glad you have been reading along though and glad I am getting some response from you.

The country is full of fools that think Obama is honest. He has never once demonstrated honesty nor does he prefer to hang out any that do.

A couple of clarifications. In a Representative Republic, the entire body politic, individually and in concert, are not to be leaders or enforcers but rather, servants (serving and protecting individual sovereign's rights, simply extending that which the sovereign could do for himself). A spin on "When government fears the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny." explains the scenario well.

Waffler, the other thought was, if people are obedient to demonic man's canons (rules) there will be less enforcement - false. By way of example: I've lived in a semi-rural community surrounded by upper middle class neighborhoods with extremely low crime rates. The like local cities are in competition to who can hire the most police per capita. Law abidance doesn't go up and crime doesn't go down - revenuers only become hyper vigilant at fiscal increase and the courts are more corrupt. Non-representative taxation (tickets and such) are most often just paid with a little grumbling thrown in for effect - those able to pay helots, serfs and slaves are easy marks.

Waffler can be likened unto a "foolish woman." " Reprove not a scorner, lest he hate thee:rebuke a wise man and he will love thee. A foolish woman is clamorous: she is simple, and knoweth nothing. For she sitteth at the door of her house, on a seat in the high places of the city. To call strangers who go Right on their ways: Whoso is simple, let him turn in hither: and as for him that wanteth understanding, she saith unto him. Stolen waters are sweet, and bread eaten in secret is pleasant. But he knoweth not that the dead are there; and that her guest are in the depths of hell." Liberty is a great treasure to be guarded well, but the fool has dug a pit, " The captive exile hasteneth that he may be loosed, and that he should not die in the pit, nor that his bread should fail. For the transgression of a land many are the princes thereof: but by a man of understanding and knowledge the state thereof shall be prolonged. The prince that wanteth understanding is also a great oppressor. He that by usury and unjust gain increaseth his substance, he shall gather for him that shall pity the poor. Woe to the O land, when thy king is a child, and thy princes eat in the morning ! Blessed art thou, O land, when thy king is the son of nobles, and thy princes eat in due season, for strength, and not for drunkenness ! Chophshiy, Eleutheria, and Apeleutheros Liberties, timeless in application. Freedom from bondage and tax at your pleasure, Manumission from slavery, Access to the presence of God a Freed man. The great whore seeks to tax all the world, guided by the "god of the storm, " The spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience. The prince of the power of the air." The god of this world is a captive exile. Those that love God and the liberty that he provides, may say, "We are of God: he that knoweth God hear us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error. " I John 4:6 honesty indeed.

Ken,Allyn, You are correct and Hitler was a very efficient bureaucrat.

Federal deficit spending is not from lack of revenue, it comes from federal over spending.

This makes little sense to me.  Anyone sincerely occupied and concerned with the public good is destined to bring forth more reasonably based responsible behavioral freedoms.